Seeing the person behind the labour: Trade Unions post-Marikana

More cautious optimism at the Mining Indaba today, Alec spoke with Chief Negotiator Dr. Elize Strydom from the Chamber of Mines about wage negotiations in the gold sector, relationship building with SA trade unions and just how likely extended strikes are in the coming year.

There aren’t too many people here from the Trade Unionists, but I’m sure you’ve been engaging with the investors.

Yes, very much so.  All the investors want to talk to one, specifically about the upcoming gold wage negotiations.  They want to get a sense of when it’s going to commence and what I think the issues are going to be, etcetera.

Lots of rumours about this is going to be a very difficult negotiation in the gold sector, some even saying that it could be as bad as platinum last year.

Let’s hope not.  Of course, from the Chamber’s side, we’re going to do everything in our power to make sure that this is a very focused, very professionally ran wage negotiations.  In 2013, I’m sure you will recall, we invited AMCU to the negotiations table for gold, and they did participate.  We are obviously, also going to invite them again, to the wage negotiations at the centre and be part of the gold wage negotiations.  We are going to try to get everyone around one table again.

Just tell us about AMCU’s representation at this point.

At this point indications are we look at the payroll figures, to see where the deductions go.  At this stage, they are 25 percent representative of the bargaining unit, for the gold, and for the NUM around 57 percent.  Then, of course, there’s Solidarity and UASA, but much smaller numbers.

What does that mean that if AMCU have to agree to what is decided, or if they don’t agree, can they take their 25 percent members away?

It’s a very difficult one to now, sort of answer.  We are hoping that we will be bargaining collectively and that we will try to see if we can come collectively to an agreement, one agreement, but we include in the agreement.  We could include different Union’s demands and our responses to those demands.  We did in fact, do that in 2013, where the AMCU pushed very hard for us to look at employee indebtedness and we included that provision in the wage agreement.  Since then have been working very hard at actually doing something about employee indebtedness.  The ideal would be one agreement signed by everybody.  In 2013 that couldn’t happen because, AMCU didn’t sign the wage agreement, but it was signed by NUM, which was on Solidarity and then, in terms of the law we then extended that agreement to AMCU and its members, and to non-affiliated employees.

And they didn’t walk out and didn’t go on strike.

They wanted to go on strike.  You will recall in January last year, they gave notice of intended strike action in platinum, as well as in gold, but the gold companies approached the Labour Court and managed to obtain an urgent interdict, prohibiting them from going on strike action in gold, on the basis that there was an existing wage agreement in place.  Which the majority had signed and which had been, in terms of the law, extended to the others.  If they had gone on strike it would have been unprotected and in contravention of the law.

This is really, interesting because at the moment we have a mining minister who is saying ‘illegal strikes are going to be clamped down on very strongly’.   I was at the Presidency on Sunday, with President Zuma, who was saying that he’s had discussions with mining leaders in Davos, earlier last month and they are confident, Government and the mining leaders, that the kind of strikes that we saw last year, are unlikely to recur in 2015.  What is your comment on all of that?  Has the tide started shifting to a more normalised situation?

We certainly hope so.  Since 2013, when we had AMCU around the wage negotiations table, for the first time, had not met Joseph Mathunjwa beforehand, (Jeff or Jimmy), and since then we have been working very hard, as the Chamber of Mines to build a relationship with AMCU, as we have done and continue to do with the NUM.  We meet on a quarterly basis, at leadership level.  We share concerns, and issues that need to be addressed, etcetera, so we have been working very hard on building a relationship and a greater level of trust.  We hope that all of that hard work, since 2013, will play a positive role during the wage negotiations.

Elize, how do you work hard on a relationship?  Do you take them out for games of golf or dinner, or to a shebeen? 

No, it was very professional.  It’s low key, no frills, getting down to the essence of things, and some very hard things are said to one another.  We hear.  We listen and listen carefully.  We see if there’s merit and try to address those issues.  For example, last week with Beatrix, we got an SMS from Mr. Mathunjwa on Friday morning at 05:00 saying, “Please can you see what’s going on?”  He didn’t only contact me of, course.  He contacted the CEO, etcetera, but me as well, and immediately we did what needed to be done.  We contacted Sibanye, found out what was happening, and reverted to him – so it is at all levels.  We engage with one another.  We respect one another and try to really foster, if that’s the right word (I don’t know if that’s the right word), a relationship where we are working collectively, for the good of the mining industry.  This is our industry.  It is not only us.  It’s us together, the Unions, and the employers and the companies.  This is our industry.  It is our future.

Just to return to Davos, another issue that came up there was the shift away serving only shareholders to stakeholders, and it’s not just something the mining industry in South Africa is doing.  It’s a global trend now.  In some ways, we might be ahead of the pack.

I think so, yes, definitely working very hard on…

I suppose it’s because you’ve had to.

We’ve had to, but also now, looking at our employees, the company, since Marikana, have really worked very hard on rebuilding their direct relationship with their employees.  Communicating more directly with the employees, not to undermine the Unions but not to leave everything to the Unions, after all they are our employees, so the communication systems have been much improved.  People are able to raise their concerns at my level.  We take it seriously.  We’re looking at accommodation, the social welfare of the employee and the spouses and children, because we see the human being behind the labour. If you don’t see that, you do that at your own peril.

It’s been interesting as well, listening to the presentations from South African chief executives.  Whereas, in the past, it was all about telling the investors how much profit they can make.

Yes.

Now there’s a much broader agenda that’s covered.

It has to be.  You cannot only focus on making a profit.  You have to have a social conscience.  You have to make sure that your employees are happy, and want to come to work.  When they work, they are safe.  When they go home, they live in reasonable accommodation (the quality of life) because, in the end, that makes perfect business sense.  You have to look after your employees.  It’s actually, really very simple.  It makes good business sense.

It’s like you, at the Chamber are finding or getting much closer to the people who are representing labour, but what about some of your members?  Neal Froneman at Sibanye has publically, at least, had quite an aggressive attitude last year.  He said, “Well, let them strike.  We’ll hold it out for some months if we need to.”  Is that part of your challenge, to get your members to also, have a single mandate? 

It is definitely part of the mandate.  In fact, the discussions in the employer caucus is often the most robust, because now you have seven gold mining companies sitting around one table, from very different places, around affordability, and philosophies, etcetera.  Then to build a common response and a common approach is quite hard but we’ve done it for a very long time in the Chamber, representing the gold members, and we are quite cohesive.  We can convince one another about what would be the best thing to do, under the current circumstances, for the wellbeing, not only of their own companies but also for the industry.

We might be in a very different place this year, to where you were last year, in the wage negotiations. 

With every round of wage negotiations, it has its own challenges but I hear what you’re saying.  Having said that, 2013, we had AMCU and NUM at one table.  We will have it again, so in that sense it is the same but the numbers, the representation has changed, so that will be taken into account as well.  From the Chamber’s side, our focus is going to be sustainability and we have to collectively, do what’s best for the industry and focus on sustainability.

Elize, I want to end with what Jacob Zuma said.  That he’s confident there won’t be another extended strike, in the mining sector.  Do you share that?

Cautiously optimistic, I would want to say I am also fairly confident but it is early days.  We need to see where things will be going.  Certainly, from our side, we will do everything as a Chamber, within our power, to try and avoid a strike, and make sure that it is the last option left, to the Unions, and we certainly hope that they will also approach it in that manner.  That a strike would be the last resort, and then once they embark on strike action, just to appreciate the damage it causes to everybody.  Thank you.

Dr Elize Strydom is the Chief Negotiator for the Chamber of Mines. 

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