Reading through this interview was such a delight for me. Ruda Landman, of Carte Blanche fame, and Penny Heyns, Olympic gold medallist, are two very noteworthy individuals that I distinctly remember from my childhood days. I was a swimmer for 12 years of my life and the name Penny Heyns was always brought up in one conversation or another when I trained or participated in galas. This open and honest interview is full of humility and determination and has made me appreciate and admire Penny even more so. Whereas I gave up swimming because I truly began to hate it (especially because I just wasn’t improving); Penny persevered and became the first (and only) woman to have won both the 100m and 200m Breaststroke events at the ’96 Atlanta Olympics. Along with Australian champion Leisel Jones, Heyns is regarded as one of the greatest breaststroke swimmers of all time. Read more on Penny’s incredible life story, what she is doing now and why being in the sporting spotlight was extremely difficult for her. – Tracey Ruff
Transcript:
R: Hello and welcome to the Change Exchange and I always get my tongue tied around that one, the Change Exchange. Say it quickly and letâs see if you can. Our guest today is Penny Heyns that we still remember as the golden girl of swimming. Youâre still the only woman who has ever won the 100 and 200m breaststroke at the Olympics.
P: Thatâs correct.
R: Quite a thing!
P: I guess it is in hindsight, at the time youâre young and you donât really realise the enormity of it and I fully expected each subsequent Olympic Games that someone would do that. And strangely enough it hasnât been done yet.
R: Did you justâŚwhen did swimming become the thing in your life. I mean as a child one just does all kinds of sports at school and then how did you grow into that?
P: Well I grew up along the coast. I was born in Springs but we moved down when I was about a year old and if you grow up along the coast youâve got to know how to swim. So I suspect I learnt around the age of two or three, joined the school team at seven and only really seriously began swimming for a club level at the age of 12. Umm ⌠as my story goes, itâs not because I loved swimming per say â itâs more the fact of recognising that I have talent and feeling a responsibility that to really develop it to its fullest. And it became apparent that swimming was the stronger of all the various sports that I did and so I guess I went from there.
R: And itâs a hard discipline, itâs⌠you put in hours, and hours and hours?
P: It is and also because itâs lonely. I think the only other discipline that perhaps is even harder would be gymnastics â because of the injuries and stuff like that. But itâs not a team sport and even if youâre a runner you still have that interaction with your teammates, swimming is very lonely. But I like that, I like the sology (sic).
R:Â What goes on in your head while youâre doing your lengths?
P: Well it really depends. I formed a habit later on while I was in College because I was so home sick. I had to find a way to focus on the here and now, so I started counting my strokes, which you donât do in free and back because itâs so complicated. But in breaststroke and butterfly, I counted my strokes and what I did there, I focused on the details because ultimately success is really just a reflection of excellence in the details. And I suppose aside from that, sometimes when you are doing the longer distances, you sing some songs or stuff like that (laughs).
R: But it sounds like almost a meditation.
P: In a sense it is. And since I retired – if I think back on my swimming career, initially anyway – the part I really missed was the training, that time alone and the quiet of that.
R: Interesting. But you were very young, only 17 when you left for America?
P: Thatâs correct.
R: How did that happen?
P: Well, it was the Olympic year in â92 when I was in matric; umm it was the first year that South Africa was readmitted into that Olympic fold, it really came as a bit of a shock ⌠I really didnât believe that we would go, I didnât grow up with an Olympic dream, because weâd been in isolation for so long. And then some of the scouts, I guess from America, were out at our Olympic trials and offered me a scholarship and, at first, I said no and I found out my coach at the time contacted them and said offer it again and they offered it again. I did not want to go.
R: Why, why?
P: Well, Barcelona was incredibly disappointing for various reasons. I came 33rd and 34th,which I always joke and say itâs close to last place. And so that was the first time in my career I thought itâs a good idea to retire. But as I sat andâŚ
R: And you were 17 (laughs)?
P: I was 17 yes, the only school pupil on the Olympic team as far as I know. And everyone else after swimming went out and enjoyed Barcelona, and I stayed behind wrestling with this idea that I have an opportunity to go to the United States. And I believe we are given talent and the next thing itâs opportunity and what we do with it really determines our destiny. And I didnât want to go and I always stress this to my audiences, because often we think that when you have a desire for something that means thatâs what you are supposed to do. And in my career I find out quite often itâs the opposite, you may not have the desire. Thatâs why, whatever you do in life, you must have a deeper foundation for why youâre doing it.
R: Why didnât you want to go?
P: Well Nebraska is in the centre of the United States. It gets down to minus 20 Celsius, with the wind chill factor even colder.
R: And this is a Durban girl.
P: Yes, itâs a Durban girl and you know I always say my first nationals was in Durban and we stayed in a hotel and I was homesick and I saw my parents throughout the day and I was still homesick. So I was not the kind of kid that slept out and visited away from home a lot. So the idea of moving all the way to the States and you know it was very daunting. And plus at that time I really didnât love swimming too much given that Iâd had such a disappointing Olympics.
R: So what ⌠what made you decide that Iâm going to take this on?
P: Well, I was quite prayerful about it and just felt that if I donât go, Iâll always wonder what if and if I donât go I also canât tell myself or my Maker that Iâve done the best I could with the opportunity and the ability I had. So I had to give it a go and I kind of thought it would be one semester and I can say âbeen there done thatâ. But I realised as I went on and finally kind of settled in over there that it is a great opportunity and at times grew to really love the sport.
R: At times?
P: At times (laughs). I think itâs important to stress that, because a lot of people think as long as you love something then youâre supposed to do it and if you donât, you move on and a lot of extremely talented people in various areas of life are led by their emotion and they never really reach their full potential.
R: So how did you handle that?
P: Crying in my goggles.
R: Itâs an incredible change for a young girl growing up there completely by yourself?
P: Yes
R: Your mother didnât go with you or anything?
P : No, in fact it was a two-day trip and I arrived in Nebraska in Lincoln – itâs a tiny little airport. I arrived at two â three oâclock came, four oâclock came and the airport was empty, then five oâclock and at six oâclock, they remembered I was arriving. So it was very difficult the first semester and there was one other South African girl whoâd arrived and some other South African guys, but they were older than me, another generation of swimmers. I really didnât know them and I always joke that I swam up and down crying in my goggles, which is the truth. There was no Skype or email, I couldnât just call home. I had to wait for every second Saturday. So I lived from every second Saturday to second Saturday. And thatâs why I say, I realised at some point that Iâm wasting my time unless I change my mind-set. Â And thatâs where the habit of counting strokes came in, because if I could manage what I am doing in the moment, to stay here and control whatever it is I am doing right now, thatâs the only way we can be successful. You know then Iâll be able to be a little happier and as I did that, obviously, I improved in my swimming. And if you improve at whatever youâre doing then you become a little more happier.
R: And then came â96 and the famous double victory.
P: Yes.
R: Did you see it coming; did you think it might go to, might happen?
P: Well I guess if someone had told me in Barcelona that you might go to the next Olympics I would have thought they were nuts. Let alone go and swim a final and I never knew that no one had done the double. If I had known, I probably wouldnât have done it, so ignorance is bliss. Umm … I had set some goals in â94. The second time I wanted to retire from swimming at the age of 19 and my mother said âyou can retire or you can choose to live with your failures and learn from them and that could be the catapult, the nugget of truth you need to go on to your future successesâ. And there I set some goals for the following two years.  And that swim-meet at the World Champs, the South African, no the Australian, girl broke the world record and I realised that in two yearsâ time I could maybe attempt to swim that time, fully thinking that she would continue to break the world record. That led up to our Olympic trials in March of â96 and I broke the world record for the first time and obviously going into the Olympics as a world record holderâŚ.
R: Go back to that moment. What, what was it like?
P: The foundation was laid pretty solidly for the two years leading up to that, so I knew arriving at the swim-meet that I had the potential to break the world record; I had actually just missed it the year before. And umm, I think because I just didnât plan on it happening then and I actually found out a few days before the swim that my parents were getting a divorce. So it could have shattered the goals I had, but I believe because the foundation had been laid for so long beforehand that there really wasnât room for any excuses, which in itself is another very valuable lesson. We always keep that excuse in the back pocket and you wonât reach your potential. The swim itself, the first 50 wasnât as fast as it should have been and, umm, I still donât how ⌠but I came back faster than ever before and it was the world record. Great elation, hoped to break it again in the evening but with all the commotion post-world record and the excitement of it, you know swimming is a sport where you need to be relaxed and find a rhythm and if you tense up and try a little bit too hard, you miss, which typically is what happened, for quite a few of my world records until later in my career.
R: And then that day at the â96 in Atlanta, â96 Olympics in Atlanta. How far apart were the two races, the two finals?
P: I think it was like two days apart. Those days you still swam heats and finals and now you have heat, semi-final and final the following evening. I had visualised that race for three months prior to the Olympics. Knowing that in Barcelona I was so overwhelmed by everything, I knew that going into Atlanta, I canât allow myself to feel that âwow this is the Olympicsâ. I have to consider it as just another event, same race, same people Iâve swam over, you know, against over the past few years. So I visualised the race, all the details of it over a hundred times, so by the time I actually swam the race, it was the heat of the 100 breaststroke, it was a matter of just let my body do what my mind had already done and it was really a sense of I canât wait to swim. I expected the other girls would swim faster as well, but it turns out they werenât as fast as I thought, so I knew going into the final that I am safe – if I swim a 90% race, I could win, and 100%, I could get my record again. It turns out it was only 90%. I made some mistakes in the final.
R: And when you realised the magnitude of this, that youâd been the first women, woman to do this? Umm, can you remember that? Was it all too much?
P: I donât think I knew til quite a bit later. I know after winning the second gold I kind of knew a little more what to expect on the podium, to take my time walking around because you know they had TVs there and they had ushers rushing you along. Everybody else is prepared and takes their time and I was this good little girl following the ushers around and I really on the first gold medal didnât enjoy it that much. I just went through the motions. Umm ⌠thereâs a South African hospitality area usually at the Olympic Games and post-medal presentations and stuff, we went over there and all the media, it was just a frenzy. I didnât really know, I just went with the flow and I donât think South Africa knew what to do with me. So in a sense, we were kind of pioneering the way forward. I was very fortunate that I, not by my own doing, had the right people around me from the very start. One of them being Zelda Van Vuuren, my manager at the time and now business partner. And if you donât – and this is what I see with the guys today â if you donât have the right people around you, youâre so young, the fame and relative money, today itâs much more. It really just, it could go to your head. And youâre tugged in every direction and everyone just wants to celebrate it, it could lead to party upon party and I think maybe guys are a little safer than girls but like I say, I was really protected. And I think that allowed me to continue and have longevity in my career, otherwise I think it might have unravelled with â96.
R: And the relationship with South Africa. Did you, did you see yourself absolutely as South Africa?
P: Definitely, in â98, I kind of went through another one of those blips where I thought I should retire, this time I was serious. So much to the point that Sam Ramsamy said, âmaybe you shouldnât swim the Commonwealth trials, sit out and watch and find out what itâs like not to be competingâ. And I did that and decided Iâll continue swimming and ahh, despite what he tried to do in terms of getting me into the team, they sort of had their rules so I couldnât go to the Commonwealth Games. At the time I was training in Canada and they offered that I could swim for Canada and I donât know, because we are all Commonwealth, there would have been a way that I could have done that. I turned it down because I felt I was born in South Africa for a reason and if I go that route, I could never turn back.
R: What, what was it like ⌠I mean South Africa was flavour of the decade and we were as a country, we were celebrated and carried on everyoneâs emotions and you became one of the personifications of that. Did you at 21, 23 feel that?
P: Umm, in my case, I look back and feel I was very blessed and lucky that the pinnacle of my Olympic career anyway happened in â96, post our World Cup successes during the time that Madiba was president, which in itself was just amazing. Umm, because he really took a personal interest in the athlete it wasnât just the President being informed by his staff, I mean he knew things before some of the people around him in terms of achievements. And Baby Jakes and others had the same stories, we had the same stories. I think that because I was based in the States for so long and the change in the country came, I really didnât know what to expect. So when we returned home I kind of thought Josiah Thugwane would have the support of African people and maybe I would ⌠there would still be this polarisation and there really wasnât, it was the whole nation celebrating together and that was just⌠it was amazing. Umm, I still donât have the words for it. Iâm very grateful like I say for the timing of my career and for the people of South Africa. And I suppose I didnât see myself as really bearing the flag in that way but in hindsight, as I say, with age you grow to appreciate it.
R: And then you were barely what 25 when you finally decided Iâm out of here?
P: Yah, well I had umm 21, withâ96 Olympics and sort of post Olympics, I would come back home and it was this great big hype. And I always say in the Joâburg airport everyone knew who I was and Iâd go back to America and no one knew who I was. And I went back to Lincoln Nebraska and I didnât know who I was ⌠and your identity changes or your sense of identity changes because itâs dictated by the reaction of other people and as athletes, we shouldnât but we find our identity â or at least at some stage in our career â in our sporting achievements. And now, I had a double gold, a world record, more than I had imagined. My coach, which didnât make it easy, I had been offered a position in Canada, partially because of the recommendation I had given and they thought Iâd follow and I decided not to. Essentially, I was in Nebraska on my own without a coach. They had someone assigned but he wasnât in the tower at the double Olympics pool and knows what to do ⌠and so I was more the coach and that really didnât work out well, and I reached a stage in 1998 where I absolutely hated swimming. I would go to the pool and get physically ill and that was just before the Commonwealth trials. Once I had decided and again very prayerfully, to go to Canada and continue my career, I had then decided it would be until 2000. So my decision to retire had nothing to do with performance or anything other than the fact that I felt in my gut that that was my career. My coach at the time said âlisten things are changing in the swimming world cup circuit. Thereâll be money now, youâll be a little more professional. Donât you want to continue?â And I just felt that it was the time to retire. Obviously one wonders.
R: You canât say why?
P: No, just again because my decision to go was prayerful. You know, I had been in the States by then for almost nine years and I never knew what life outside of swimming was and umm, my â99 season was the best of my career. Eleven world records in 11 weeks and I donât know how it happened. And I was on par to do that and even better in 2000, but then there were some unforeseen circumstances and some I couldnât control with the passing of a teammate and I was a little too involved in that. And ummâŚsome other decisions I made with regards to training. As you get older youâve got to adapt your training and I donât think we did that successfully, so 2000 was one step forward two steps back. It didnât end the way I would have hoped. And if â99 was a reflection, then it should have been another double gold but it wasnât it was a bronze. I didnât retire because of that, but I felt at the time that it was the end of the career. Also, the people I admired in the sport and were my peers had sort of reached the age where they were retiring. And those days we were retiring quite early. I only announced my retirement ⌠ I think it was March of 2001 ⌠because Sam Ramsamy and others had encouraged me not to and hoped I would change my mind. And ummâŚmy mom passed away very unexpectedly in May of 2001 and when that happened, I realised that this was the right time to retire because had I not, I would have been back in the States or Canada and I wouldnât have had that last Christmas and few months with her, so everything happens as it should.
R: So how does one make thatâŚitâs such an enormous change. You say your life was swimming and you cut that off and then?
P: Complicated. For many reasons, I mean it wasnât as simple as Iâm just retiring from swimming. You know because Iâd been based in the States and Canada to a large degree I escaped the hype of South Africa, the fame, I hate the word but all of that and everything that goes with it. Iâm quite a private person despite the fact that I do a lot of public stuff, I think a little bit introverted so I was comfortable and safe in Canada, so I moved back home and the adjustment to retiring from swimming, and the adjusting to returning to South Africa and at that stage there werenât any other successes in swimming and dealing with the public, just never ever felt comfortable. I think it was probably, a year or two or three ago that I started going out into public on my own cause you donât know that people are looking at you because youâre looking funny or they recognise you. You know what itâs like. And African people are great and they donât have inhibitions and they come in and chat and say what they want to say then itâs over and done. And, but especially conservative Afrikaans people because they donât want to intrude, but at the same time they are still looking and itâs difficult. And I just would hide away rather and, on top of that, you know you hear about all the crime in South Africa and Iâm safe over there and coming back here, for about 10 years that was very much top of my awareness. And ⌠umm ⌠of course my motherâs passing. And trying to go into the world of business and the adjustment.
R: What did you do? What did you find to do?
P: At first, everyone would expect you to go, continue in the world of swimming and, at the time, I think every swimmer has his or her struggles with the federation. Sometimes we are wrong and sometimes the federation has their part and I think itâs a bit of both. And so I had enough of swimming, I wanted nothing to do with the sport. And so I tried my hand at property and various other business ventures and I was very fortunate once again Zelda had worked ⌠is an entrepreneur and I was kind of guided. When you come out of the sport thatâs individual, you are the boss. And now I go into a business, I have a partner who knows way more than me and Iâm still trying to be the boss. So that in itself had its own issues that I had to learn and work through but long story short, by the time I think it was after 2010, I was asked by one of the coaches to get involved with his breaststroke swimmers and coach them and I was back on pool deck and really loved it, and found that for the first time again I had that gut feel. When I swam I went on a gut feel, I knew what I had to do and now again on pool deck I know what to do. And other than that, grew the swim clinics that we now present and camps. A lot of them in South Africa and surprisingly last year a lot of them up in Africa. Part of those countries are the expats. Tanzania and Kenya were more the local teams, umm ⌠Namibia as well. So itâs a nice mix. And then, all along Iâve always been involved in the corporate speaking side, motivational speaking and in addition to that over the last, I think it was about four years we started adding other tools letâs say into the programme, brain-based learning development tools. We do a lot of stuff in the schools with the educators, in the corporate sector as well. Iâm loving it. I kind of found out Iâm a teacher at heart. And I love to motivate, you can be as tired and as down and whatever and suddenly somehow on the day when youâve got to deal with teaching people and helping people, thereâs a new energy that comes. So Iâm loving what Iâm doing. I think probably more so than even in my swimming career. I feel more at ease and comfortable in my own skin and feel like Iâm in the right place in my life right now. I suppose it also comes with age.
R: And who are the people around you who support you?
P: I think obviously my business partner Zelda, whoâs now the big sister. Her whole family, we joke Iâm the adopted little one in the family because they are in Pretoria where I live. My father and my two brothers are strong supporters still. There are other people one of them is a past teacher of mine throughout my high school years. My other mother, Louise Lemmer, whoâs now the head of Toti, Toti high school. I have people like that who are supporters still. And sadly for my generation, those of us who are still in South Africa, our close friends coming out of school and college and stuff, in my case especially, they are overseas. So you tend to, a lot of our work is over the weekends and so ummâŚit becomes a little bit isolated in that sense.
R: Hard to keep up the connection?
P: Yah, you kind of find this question of âwhat are you doing now?â and trying to catch up after however many years awkward.
R: Yes! And you say you live in Pretoria now, are you, whatâs your home like?
P: Ok, I kind of decided about three years ago that given the travel, having a home and the schlep of the responsibility was too much, so I sold and then opted to rent and lock up and go ⌠and then an opportunity came about to build with a whole bunch of other people on a farm outside of Pretoria and I thought why not, you know, I need a washing machine, thatâs about it. And you know for, I grew up in a home with animals and then going to the States and living in Pretoria for over 10 years, itâs almost been for 18 years that I wasnât able to have any animals and now being on a farm, thereâs 12 dogs! (laughs). They keep me busy, Iâm tired! But it doesnât just belong to me. I can come and go as I please, and I like the bush, I like to escape in nature and have my own time.
R: And what makes your space yours? Do you have something special that you take with you?
P: You mean when I travel?
R: No, into your new home, is there a special couch?
P: No
R: No?
P: No, a lot of stuff is still in storage. And I think I got used to when I was overseas to be quite minimalistic, because you know you travel a lot so I tend to carry that over. I suppose a bed is always important, you keep the same bed, the comfortable mattress. Umm, I just think moving now to an environment where I have more space, the bushveld, the farm and the animals, thatâs home.
R: All of the very best. I hope it is a very good year for you.
P: Thank you, I am sure it will be, to you too.
R: Thank you.
P: Thanks.
- This article first appeared on the Change Exchange, an online platform by BrightRock, provider of the first-ever life insurance that changes as your life changes.
A tweet from Penny’s Twitter account
Back in Dar es Salaam for another #PHSwimCamp. Kicking off day1 with Breaststroke. pic.twitter.com/97kSItdmM4
â Penny Heyns (@pennyheyns) February 20, 2015
