🔒 Members Only Ep 4 – Gauteng’s new government, new voices reshaping media and hot stock picks

In Ep 4, Alec Hogg and Bronwyn Nielsen focus on Gauteng’s new government as they unveil bold policies aimed at reshaping the province’s landscape. This comes amidst a wave of new voices in the media, exemplified by figures like Gareth Cliff and Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh, who are driving conversations on national platforms. Additionally, they provide hot stock picks for 2024, highlighting opportunities in the market. The episode delves into these dynamic shifts, offering insights into both political and economic spheres shaping South Africa’s future.

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Highlights from the Interview

Members Only Ep 4 delves into a dynamic array of topics shaping South Africa’s landscape. The spotlight is on Gauteng’s new government, which is unveiling ambitious policies aimed at transforming the province. This shift comes amidst a broader conversation about the influence of new voices in media and society, represented prominently by figures like Gareth Cliff and Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh. These individuals are driving discussions on national platforms, emphasizing accountability and fresh perspectives in governance and public discourse.

In the financial realm, experts provide compelling insights into 2024’s hot stock picks, identifying key opportunities in the market. The interview explores these topics with depth, offering a blend of political analysis, media dynamics, and economic forecasts. It underscores the evolving nature of South Africa’s socio-political environment, where youth and innovation intersect with traditional institutions to chart a course forward. “Members Only Ep 4” serves as a window into these transformative forces, illustrating how diverse voices and economic strategies are shaping the nation’s trajectory amidst global uncertainties.

Edited transcript of the Interview

00:00:06:05 – 00:00:16:17
Alec Hogg:
Members only. Episode four already. Jeepers, it feels like the year is flying away. But when you do, you project that we into our fourth episode. Well.

00:00:16:19 – 00:00:47:00
Bronwyn Nielsen:
Time certainly does fly, and lots on the go this week. I think the market’s sighing in relief in terms of holding together and not imploding. Although the ANC is clearly pushing the DA out from the negotiating table, and Helen Zille, I listened to your interview with her earlier this week, and she’s very firm in saying, if we can’t actually make a difference…

00:00:47:00 – 00:00:56:13
Bronwyn Nielsen:
…and if the ANC can’t honour what we initially agreed on, they won’t play. They’ll go opposition in Gauteng.

00:00:56:15 – 00:01:21:21
Alec Hogg:
That’s what it’s all about at the moment. And I remember so well being in Davos in 2018 when Cyril Ramaphosa was the belle of the ball. He had his beautiful smile. Beautiful smile, I guess you could call it. Everybody loved Cyril. This was going to be the South African turnaround. Ramaphosa we called it. Markets wind up.

00:01:21:23 – 00:01:31:05
Alec Hogg:
We got in euphoria. Right now, I don’t know though how well-founded this one was, in the same way as Ramaphosa wasn’t that well founded.

00:01:31:06 – 00:01:54:18
Bronwyn Nielsen:
Well, the rand is certainly reacting well. We’re seeing strengthening against the crosses. And again, the rand is anybody’s guess. And of course, volatility is the name of the game. So let’s see if that hangs together. Right now, markets possibly sighing in relief. I’ve got Jean-Pierre Fouché, who I’ll be chatting to. He’s now the CEO of Protea Capital Management.

00:01:54:22 – 00:02:18:17
Bronwyn Nielsen:
You have known Jean-Pierre from 361 Asset Management days, from Fairtree. So he’s going to give us a great round-up of the markets. And I’m looking forward to that engagement. And that follows Paul and David earlier this week who were both very bullish, although they have that big offshore play. And it will be interesting to see whether Jean-Pierre Fouché is also in the offshore game.

00:02:18:19 – 00:02:42:21
Alec Hogg:
That offshore play is now really coming home. We’ve seen Amazon get above $200 a share. Look at Tesla. It’s almost like the commentators just don’t get Tesla because when the numbers came out, the sales were down again. The commentators were saying, well, look at this. Tesla’s definitely not delivering, but they aren’t getting it.

00:02:42:23 – 00:03:09:02
Alec Hogg:
The reason why Tesla is flying and it went from, well, I know when we bought it in the model portfolio, our last tranche in the web-traded portfolio was $140. It’s now $250. And after the results, it’s gone from below $200 to above $250. And the story there is so much bigger than what the market commentators are seeing.

00:03:09:02 – 00:03:35:03
Alec Hogg:
And the story really is autonomous taxis that you can deliver. And Elon says he’s going to give a big announcement on the 8th of August. So it’s so interesting when you sit in South Africa and you’ve got a little bit of distance and you can stay away a little bit from the noise of Wall Street and see through all of that to see exactly what investors are doing, what prices are doing.

00:03:35:03 – 00:03:47:04
Alec Hogg:
And as a consequence, read past what some of the pundits are saying. So many of them are just way, way out of kilter with the reality of what’s happening in the world.

00:03:47:06 – 00:04:14:10
Bronwyn Nielsen:
Well Cy Jacobs must be tearing his hair out right now because at the BizNews conference in March, he was saying Tesla is headed for implosion and he cannot see the sustainability of that business. So it will be interesting to get Jean-Pierre’s viewpoint on it. And then next week, I’ve lined up Magda Wierzycka to have the same market conversation and get her view on what is happening.

00:04:14:10 – 00:04:28:07
Bronwyn Nielsen:
I’ll definitely put Tesla to her just in the favorable quotes for Tesla is, of course, Paul Theron. He is a firm player in Elon’s universe and specifically Tesla.

00:04:28:09 – 00:04:53:06
Alec Hogg:
Magda Wierzycka is interesting because she’s also very much in the camp that looks beyond the obvious. As you remember, she had the first industrial revolution portfolio that she started here in South Africa, which has made a lot of people a lot of money. So I think she’ll be more in the Paul Theron camp, if you like, than in the Cy Jacobs camp.

00:04:53:06 – 00:05:25:00
Alec Hogg:
But Cy’s not complaining. He’s had a phenomenal run. If you recall, he was betting big on a positive outcome for the South African election. And I think he had the ability to go and take a few days off as a result of that. His investors have done really well. But let’s maybe start in Gauteng because after the election we had—and the reason why we talk about the election is in a developing country, politics trumps economics.

00:05:25:00 – 00:05:50:18
Alec Hogg:
And if you don’t get the politics right, forget about the economics. They don’t matter. But in South Africa, after the May 29th election, we had three big issues. The first was the national government with the ANC down at 40%. Who were they going to coalesce with? The second was KwaZulu-Natal with Jacob Zuma’s MK was by far the biggest party but didn’t have a majority, and together with the EFF, didn’t have a majority…

00:05:50:18 – 00:06:14:06
Alec Hogg
They won one seat, one seat short, and then the other was counting where the ANC was hammered 50% down to 34%, but still the biggest party. However, what were they going to do there? Well, you know, things got settled quite quickly in KZN. All the non-MK/EFF parties, in other words, all the non-socialist parties, got together.

00:06:14:08 – 00:06:48:13
Alec Hogg
Helen Zille, in our conversation this week, said it took five minutes to sign that off. My question was, well, you had the tricky situation in KZN, where they needed to get one extra seat, either party. And that was the NFP (National Freedom Party). Whichever one they had gone with, the DA, IFP, ANC alliance, or with MK and the EFF, they would have had the swing vote or the balance of power.

00:06:48:15 – 00:06:53:23
Alec Hogg
Well, they decided to go with the DA, so she said it was five minutes all done. Okay.

Read more:  Members Only Ep1 – Witnessing SA’s ‘second transition’, a political watershed

00:06:53:23 – 00:07:00:23
Bronwyn Nielsen
And she said, because I was listening to that conversation, the IFP honoured the agreement. Yeah, that’s…

00:07:01:05 – 00:07:20:13
Alec Hogg
The IFP always will. They are very honourable people. Hlabisa, who has been to a couple of our conferences and we’ve engaged with a lot on BizNewsTV, is an honourable man. You can see he’s more of a statesman than a politician. But that is not the case. It is done.

00:07:20:15 – 00:08:05:07
Alec Hogg
Now we get to Gauteng. Helen spoke to me yesterday, just after she got off the plane, and she was pretty feisty. She hadn’t got all the news from the ANC yet that they had not upped the offer of three cabinet seats. Her deal was that if it’s just the ANC and the DA, they need five cabinet seats to the ANC’s six because of the number of seats they have in the provincial government: 28 for the ANC, 22 for the DA. By their calculation, it would have been the premier plus five for the ANC and five for the DA.

00:08:05:07 – 00:08:30:16
Alec Hogg
They voted on that, and the ANC offered them three seats and only really crappy ministries as well. So, a little bit like what Ramaphosa has done to the DA at the national government level. People are seeing this and saying, hang on a bit. I asked her about that and she said they were under the impression that there were 27 ministries.

00:08:30:18 – 00:09:02:16
Alec Hogg
So, six out of 27 we thought was pretty reasonable. It wasn’t great, but it was acceptable. When we heard the announcement, there were 33 ministries. If we hadn’t signed that agreement, maybe we wouldn’t have. So, there’s already a little bit of niggle in this shotgun marriage. But getting back to Gauteng, it appears as though Lesufi, the very poorly performing premier, has got his own road.

00:09:02:20 – 00:09:08:12
Alec Hogg
He wants to do a deal. He thinks he can do a deal with the EFF, but he hasn’t brought them into the cabinet yet.

00:09:08:14 – 00:09:37:01
Bronwyn Nielsen
And we’re talking about, here Alec, the economic hub of South Africa. This is not a small territory. In terms of our economy and growth, if we can’t get, I can’t see that the DA could be ousted from the governance of Gauteng. And then we still call this a government of national unity, or am I being too much of a detractor here?

00:09:37:05 – 00:09:56:08
Alec Hogg
Well, I thought so, and I think the markets were a bit worried about that as well, because we’ve seen the way that the rand has been weakening as these negotiations are going on. But that was a question to Helen. She said, no, no, no, it’s got nothing to do with our pact with the government at the national level. That continues. Nothing to do with KwaZulu-Natal or Gauteng.

00:09:56:08 – 00:10:21:09
Alec Hogg
We are treating them differently. Essentially, what she was saying was that there are different factions in parts of the ANC and infighting. The Cyril faction is smaller than the Mashatile faction, and the Delhi faction is where Lesufi is and so on. But the real story here is the first vote of no confidence. When Lesufi, as the premier, has to face a vote of no confidence.

00:10:21:09 – 00:10:50:12
Alec Hogg
How’s that going to go? Right now, I wouldn’t fancy his chances of remaining premier because remember, he only got there because the DA voted him in. If the DA doesn’t vote him in, it’s going to be fun and games in Gauteng. Horrible for the people in the province because they get this government which just can’t get out of its own way, which just seems to want to continue along the path that it had in the past without any thought whatsoever for the people.

00:10:50:14 – 00:10:56:21
Alec Hogg
It’s all about me, me, me, man. You’ve got to use your votes more wisely next time.

00:10:56:21 – 00:11:26:05
Bronwyn Nielsen
And that’s exactly what Helen said to you, is that you get the government that you vote for. So you are absolutely right. We need to use those votes more intelligently. Helen made the point that the smaller parties have fractured the opposition in terms of pulling votes away from a strong DA. Anyway, that aside, there’s just one more thing that I want to focus on from a national government level and looking at the ministries.

00:11:26:05 – 00:11:58:22
Bronwyn Nielsen
Of course, the bloated cabinet, ministers, additional ministers, deputy ministers, we’re going to be looking at that blue light brigade dominating the country going forward. I was very interested in the fact that the DA settled, John Steenhuisen settled for Minister of Agriculture, and we saw Parks Tau. I’m definitely not saying that the Minister of Agriculture isn’t an incredibly important position in South Africa.

00:11:59:00 – 00:12:32:11
Bronwyn Nielsen
But Parks Tau being put in as Minister of Trade and Industry. This was the big stumbling block when it came to what the DA wanted. Parks Tau’s track record as mayor of Johannesburg, I know you chatted to Herman Mashaba, but he took over a very dishevelled Johannesburg post-Parks Tao. Now, with that track record, going into one of the most powerful, influential portfolios in South Africa, I don’t know what news you’ve got on that side, Alec.

00:12:35:16 – 00:13:07:12
Alec Hogg
Well, I know Ebrahim Patel, the previous incumbent, very well. While I don’t agree with his politics or strategies, he comes from a very different point of view to the free-market entrepreneur, one that I’m from. He is one of the most honest people I’ve ever met. I’ve had many conversations with him where he was horrified at issues that he had uncovered, where there was corruption.

00:13:07:12 – 00:13:45:21
Alec Hogg
So he was straight as a guy. You can criticize Ebrahim in many areas, but you can’t criticize his integrity. Parks Tau, having taken over that portfolio where the opportunity for corruption is probably the highest in any part of government, his track record is incredibly blemished. I put that to Herman Mashaba, who’s just back from a holiday and said he decided the best thing to do while all of this chaos was going on with the negotiations and that, and he did not want to get sucked into it from day one. He said, “We’re not going to be part of this government. Forget it. We’re not aligning with the ANC.” He went off with his wife and daughter, and they were out of the country. He got back today and spoke with us this afternoon. I said to him, “You’ve got to tell me about Parks Tau because exactly as you say, when Herman became the executive mayor of Johannesburg, that’s who he took over from.”

00:14:06:19 – 00:14:34:17
Alec Hogg
He was the executive mayor for three years. He says this guy couldn’t run Jo’burg. Now he’s way above his paygrade by taking over trade and industry. But worse than that, he either didn’t see it or he wouldn’t see the 35 billion rand in corruption, which was there for all to see once he was the mayor. Herman said he took those dossiers, took that information, and gave it to Cyril Ramaphosa.

00:14:34:19 – 00:14:57:16
Alec Hogg
So it’s not like Ramaphosa’s sitting there and not knowing whether Parks Tau is good or not. He’s got the information. Herman shakes his head and says, unfortunately, this government of national unity has got to work. As citizens of this country, we’ve just got to pull for it to work because the alternative is too ghastly to contemplate. But appointments like this, on which the whole government of national unity could have easily fallen, do raise scepticism in me. I don’t know how long this can go on for. Good luck.

00:14:57:18 – 00:15:22:14
Alec Hogg
For the moment, you talk about John Steenhuisen. Agriculture is, he must have a very good reason for taking that portfolio. We do understand from the DA’s side that Geordin Hill-Lewis was going to be the trade and industry minister anyway. It wouldn’t have been a portfolio for Steenhuisen, and he would have looked at something else. Perhaps agriculture, without the land reform part of it, because agriculture is so big in this country in the production of food, export, and the difficulties we’ve had with our ports, etc. Maybe that’s an area where John Steenhuisen thinks he can make a big impact.

00:15:55:09 – 00:16:24:01
Alec Hogg
We surely need a really good Minister of Agriculture. In fact, we need good ministers across the board. But it’s positive to see someone like Leon Schreiber, who on his first day on the job comes out with a temporary visa story where he’s clearly wanting to get this country working again and making it a place where we can attract international workers who can come and live in the Western Cape, presumably because that’s the place that does work in South Africa.

00:16:24:03 – 00:16:47:17
Alec Hogg
On these visas, bring their pounds and euros and dollars in, because there’s no better place in the world if you’ve got good connectivity. And remember, with such a remote way of working nowadays, to live in the Western Cape, one of the best places in the world for sure. So open that up, open the floodgates, bring the hard currency in, and away we go.

00:16:47:17 – 00:17:17:04
Alec Hogg
And on day one, he did that. On day one, Dean McPherson, who’s taken over as Public Works, is talking about, “Please give me information on land that the government owns, which we can use more productively.” So already we’re seeing these new DA ministers injecting energy. Remember, four of them are in their 30s. Yeah, therefore, ministers of this cabinet, this bloated cabinet of 33, four of them are in their 30s, and all four were put there by the DA.

00:17:17:04 – 00:17:52:03
Alec Hogg
So well done to the DA. If they can perform, then perhaps in the next election in 2026, we’ll see an even bigger swing as we saw in the last one. And then in 2029, who knows? Anything could happen. But for now, we need to be vigilant as members of the media, and we need to hold these politicians to account because it’ll be so damn easy in a government of national unity for everyone to get caught up in the euphoria and to start sycophantically supporting these people in power.

00:17:52:03 – 00:18:01:00
Alec Hogg
And we know as good as you might be when you start there, that power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. So please don’t give these guys absolute power.

00:18:01:01 – 00:18:23:03
Bronwyn Nielsen
I’m certainly going to keep my eyes on that trade and industry portfolio. Another very interesting theme you’ve brought to the fore is the new voices, the young voices that you’ve got on the platform. And it brings me to the age of the minister that you’re talking about. Two of them in their early 30s. It’s four of them.

00:18:23:05 – 00:18:24:10
Alec Hogg
Yeah, yeah.

00:18:24:12 – 00:18:49:06
Bronwyn Nielsen
Phumlani Majozi, who you spoke to earlier this week, just indicating that the average age in South Africa is 26. So we’re all catering for a youth portfolio, and we have to have those young voices in government. So great news on that front. Talk to me a little bit about this theme of new voices because you’ve got Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh, Gareth Cliff. He’s not a new voice.

Read more:  Members Only Ep2 – By-elections, Zille and why SA assets still very cheap

00:18:49:06 – 00:19:09:00
Bronwyn Nielsen
I mean, he’s been around. You have made the point, a quarter of a century as a media entrepreneur, but great interviews coming to the fore here. And these gentlemen don’t hold back on their opinions with regard to South Africa, where we are headed, and the level of accountability that is needed, as you say, in government.

00:19:09:02 – 00:19:39:03
Alec Hogg
Well, Bronwyn, you and I are pretty rare in our industry. Most journalists work for a big corporation, a big organization. They use that platform and then perhaps go into PR or investment analysis, but they either stay at a publication or go into those other areas. It’s been very rare for journalists like you and I to start our own companies. However, that has all changed with the dawn of the internet. What I wanted to do in this mini-series, and we’re working on it, certainly Black Pen will be with us when I get back from the US, is to try and get these fresh voices and introduce them to our tribe.

00:20:01:17 – 00:20:26:22
Alec Hogg
The three that I spoke to this week were all impressive. Gareth Cliff, I’ve known. In fact, he reminded me—I reminded him, I can’t remember that—he and two of his colleagues came and pitched at Moneyweb when they were in their 20s. They were students, and they had a portal called Get a Life Galaxy out of today.

00:20:27:00 – 00:20:55:15
Alec Hogg
And unfortunately, when one of their colleagues, John, a really smart guy, passed away at 26 due to a heart attack. A really sad story. But Alan Forward is still very much around. And of course, Gareth has gone on to bigger and better things. For whatever reason, we didn’t pursue that partnership. I was very keen, but I think my colleagues were maybe a little nervous about these youngsters, these 20-year-olds who were changing the world in the same ways we were trying to change the world there.

00:20:55:17 – 00:21:14:17
Alec Hogg
But Gareth has been a wonderful addition to the South African media landscape. He tells it like it is, and the fact that he has his own business and has been running it for more than ten years shows that he can do those things. You know the value of that, as I very much do.

00:21:14:18 – 00:21:41:14
Alec Hogg
And then this afternoon, so it hasn’t quite been published yet but will be any moment now, Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh, who has got SMWX. That’s his platform, and it’s huge. Hundreds of thousands of people are watching his videos. And he has an Oxford doctorate. Now, I know James Myburgh at Politicsweb also has an Oxford doctorate.

00:21:41:16 – 00:22:06:13
Alec Hogg
But outside of James, there’s nobody else in journalism who even comes close to having a doctorate from Oxford University. And I don’t think we can quantify or classify R.W. Johnson, who was there for 26 years as a teacher, as a lecturer, as a don, but Sizwe has decided that he can make the biggest contribution to his country, and he just loves this place, as we all do.

00:22:06:15 – 00:22:28:17
Alec Hogg
By being a voice and not a gotcha journalist. And I love that about what he was saying. He is not there to have interviews with people and catch them out, as we’ve seen unfortunately in many of the big media companies around the world. Gotchas are a big thing, you know, ask a question and then they say something that they didn’t mean to say.

00:22:28:17 – 00:22:52:00
Alec Hogg
Gotcha. He says he’s there to talk and to hear opinions and ideas and to learn himself in the process. Gareth said exactly the same thing. And that way, giving his audience the ability to make decisions. My word, that’s like music to my ears because so many people in our industry think they’ve got a lecture.

00:22:52:00 – 00:23:16:04
Alec Hogg
You know, they’re going to tell you what you’re supposed to be thinking. Whereas what we should be doing, I believe, is providing a platform and facilitating the contestation of ideas, which Sizwe also spoke a lot about—the contestation of ideas. And indeed, he’s starting his own think tank. So it’s been fascinating getting these new voices.

00:23:16:04 – 00:23:35:03
Alec Hogg
And I really would like to hear more of them and follow more of the work that they’re doing because it is important that one gets insights from younger people, which in our country almost seems to have been absent for far too long.

00:23:35:05 – 00:24:04:05
Bronwyn Nielsen
I’m really looking forward to listening to Sizwe Mpofu-Walsh in the YouTube investigation space. He jumped straight into my attention just in terms of the manner with which he conducts those interviews. He is so eloquent, and I’m looking forward to hearing him on the business platform. You say you are off to the US, Alec, work-related?

00:24:04:07 – 00:24:31:10
Alec Hogg
Yeah, going to the Washington Post. It’s one of my, I don’t know, bucket list items. Call it what you like. My hero in our industry is Katharine Graham, the publisher of the Washington Post. She inherited the company from her late father—or not really from her father, but from her husband, who committed suicide, Phil Graham.

00:24:31:12 – 00:24:54:07
Alec Hogg
And she had been a stay-at-home mom, and then her father had started the Order not to start but bought the Washington Post. He was a Federal Reserve chairman. He was the Alan Greenspan of the 1930s, a Federal Reserve chairman. And she just did incredible work at the Washington Post. She had—everybody had the story, but she was the only one prepared to run with Watergate.

00:24:54:09 – 00:25:18:00
Alec Hogg
And that’s so much of what I’ve learned from her. And now I’m going to go and see the house that Katharine built. So of course, Warren Buffett’s very involved there as well because he was doing a takeover bid of the Washington Post shortly after she assumed control when the share price had just fallen right out of bed with the death of her husband.

00:25:18:02 – 00:25:34:19
Alec Hogg
And she phoned him and said, “Mr. Buffett, please, please don’t buy my company from me.” And he said, “Okay, I’ll stop buying, but then I’m going to help you.” And he did. He spent quite a bit of time with her, explaining how to run newspapers. So putting it all together.

00:25:34:19 – 00:26:02:22
Alec Hogg
And of course, on top of that, you’ve got Jeff Bezos, you know, who owns it and has injected some incredible technology into the backend of the Washington Post. They’ve got lots of issues going on now with the newsroom and the journalists and that stuff. So it’s at the sharp edge of our industry. And I’m really looking forward to engaging with him, learning, and coming home and perhaps finding things from there that we can implement.

00:26:03:00 – 00:26:07:18
Bronwyn Nielsen
And bringing those stories about Katharine Graham, The Washington.

Read more:  Members Only Ep 3 – Rand’s GNU verdict, demented Biden and Paul Theron

00:26:07:19 – 00:26:44:06
Alec Hogg
Post. Katharine Graham is just, you know, you’ve got to read her book. It won a Pulitzer. Her autobiography is called “Personal History.” It’s just the most inspiring book that I’ve read of anybody in our industry. She just used it again. We spoke earlier about integrity, honesty, doing the right thing, having respect for the people that you work with, that you report on—just a really decent, thoroughly decent, courageous, strong corporate leader.

00:26:44:08 – 00:26:51:07
Alec Hogg
And we need more of that. Well, I don’t think you can get more Katharine Grahams, but at least we can aspire to be like her.

00:26:51:09 – 00:26:56:05
Bronwyn Nielsen
Can’t wait for those insights when you get back. And always a pleasure. Thank you so much.

00:26:56:07 – 00:27:16:15
Alec Hogg
It’s been a pleasure as well, Bronwyn. And before you go, you just gotta leave us with a couple of hot stocks. Are you back on that horse again? The full interview is doing terribly well. David also, and you did say you’d be talking to Jean-Pierre in a little while, but what are they keen on?

00:27:16:15 – 00:27:22:01
Alec Hogg
Is there anything we can go and investigate further?

00:27:22:03 – 00:27:50:03
Bronwyn Nielsen
So Paul’s hottest stock was Amgen. It was in the health space, remember? It was in the weight loss drugs space. And they’re bringing in a pill over the injectable. So he says, watch Amgen. Aspen on the local front, Paul has been a long-time supporter. Nvidia, Paul still says go in. It’s an old-style, but you know, he’s never one to shy away from the growth story.

00:27:50:05 – 00:28:16:03
Bronwyn Nielsen
He reckons when you believe in a stock, Microsoft, same thing. You go in, you hold it, and you don’t deviate from the story. David, I just want to pull back to he was looking at the property stocks. Now, he’s not a property man, but he’s saying very interesting things unfolding in a small, stable government arena and potentially those property yields worth focusing on bonds.

00:28:16:06 – 00:28:49:00
Bronwyn Nielsen
He also said bond yields, a place to be. And he made the statement he’s an equities man. So it’s very easy for David Shapiro to start supporting bonds. And then I’m just trying to think if there was anything that David, in particular, threw forward to, you’ve caught me off guard and, well, there is a stock. I know, and I’m not sure if it’s us that he’s chatted about, but I would hate to put that out there without getting him to endorse it.

00:28:49:01 – 00:28:50:12
Bronwyn Nielsen
Jean-Pierre.

00:28:50:13 – 00:29:14:22
Alec Hogg
Louis, you can keep that’s a bit for you. And that was the one he really liked. But just to close off with David Shapiro, we are very grateful to David Shapiro’s obsession with ASML. He has been talking ASML for ages. Eventually, some time ago, I did the research on ASML, edited it into the model portfolios and the business portfolios, and it’s been an absolute winner.

00:29:15:04 – 00:29:38:06
Alec Hogg
So, Mr. Shapiro, when I think of ASML, I think of you. And when I think of you, I think of him as a model. So there we go. He had a big winner there. He was very excited about it and has been for a long time. And he’s written that goes all the way through. But we’re going to be—I’m not sure if we’re going to be talking next week, and we’ll do our best to try and find a time, wherever in the world you might be.

00:29:38:06 – 00:29:52:12
Alec Hogg
And I certainly will be in the US running around there, but we certainly will be back with episode five later in the month. So until then, from me, Alec Hogg, and Bronwyn Nielsen, the founder of the Nielsen Network. Cheerio.

00:29:52:14 – 00:29:52:22
Bronwyn Nielsen
Thanks, Alec.

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