Kokkie Kooyman on Berkshire Hathaway 2014 AGM: Why he’s back – for the 14th time
SIM Global's Kokkie Kooyman (below, with son Ben) is one of the few South African money managers who have an international reputation. He has won some of the world's most prestigious asset management awards, and keeps in touch by travelling for a fortnight, eight times a year. One of his "must do" trips is the Berkshire Hathaway annual general meeting in Omaha, an event at which he entertains clients – a record 54 this year. Listen to the interview below for the reasons why he keeps coming back and what he learns from the exercise. – AH
ALEC HOGG: We're in Omaha, waiting for the bus to come and fetch us. Kokkie, this is a new one for us, catching a bus in Omaha.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Yes, it's a real experience…the Warren Buffett way.
ALEC HOGG: Have you done it before? Have you been on these buses?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: I've done one, yes.
ALEC HOGG: And why are we taking the bus today?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: It's nice. You get to see Omaha.
ALEC HOGG: But where are we going?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: And it's cheap. It's good value for money.
ALEC HOGG: This is an interview. You're supposed to tell people where we're going.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: We're going to Nebraska Furniture Mart.
ALEC HOGG: Why?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: The technological stuff there is nice and cheap. You get good value.
ALEC HOGG: Is it cheaper than RadioShack?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: It's cheaper than RadioShack.
ALEC HOGG: And here's the bus. Let's get on. All right, so we're on the bus now. It looks rather like a South African bus.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Yes.
ALEC HOGG: I see Paul's here with you. Paul, how many times have you been to Omaha?
PAUL: This is the third time.
ALEC HOGG: And you, Kokkie?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Fourteen.
ALEC HOGG: Why so many – 14?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: I like Warren.
PAUL: No, you just keep learning.
ALEC HOGG: Do you really…after 14 years?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: I think every year marginally, but it's more taking clients along, people enjoy it, and you just enjoy the talks about investments and Warren.
ALEC HOGG: How many people are you bringing this year?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: This year is a record number – 54 South Africans.
ALEC HOGG: They should give you U.S. citizenship for that.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Well, we thought of bringing a South African flag just to show.
ALEC HOGG: Where do you sit? Fifty-four people…that's a lot of seats.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: It's going to be a problem. It's a rush. The doors open at 7:00 and then everybody charges for a good seat. You get all these elderly gentlemen racing us for a good seat – millionaires' dash.
ALEC HOGG: Millionaires' dash. I didn't believe it, but we actually are on a bus in Omaha. It's bloody cold here this year.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: It's very cold this year.
ALEC HOGG: They guys you're bringing out: who are they?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: They're mostly clients, but ex-CEO's, senior businesspeople, retired people, and many young investors who are very keen. There's the Kiewit Plaza. That's Warren Buffett's head office – Kiewit Plaza
ALEC HOGG: Oh, is that what that is?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: He only takes one floor, by the way. He doesn't take the entire building. Last year, Bernard Swanepoel came. Laurie Dippenaar's been six times. Johan Burger has been…
ALEC HOGG: Who's your big name this year?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: The biggest name?
ALEC HOGG: David Shapiro.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: David Shapiro. No, guys like you are coming here, ex-Coronation…
ALEC HOGG: I suppose he can afford it now.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: He can afford it now.
ALEC HOGG: Kokkie, I'm intrigued. Fourteen times to come and listen to old chaps… How much longer do you think they're going to carry on for, or is it like every year you think this might be the last time?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: No, I think that's why the numbers are increasing. Increasingly, people are saying 'I want to come before they die'. It's a sad story, but you don't know how long this lasts. Based on their ages, statistically speaking they should be around another 14 years.
ALEC HOGG: Warren's 83, so he has a few more years to go.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Yes, Charlie is 89…turning 90 this year. Wow, so we're going to have to sing for him.
ALEC HOGG: I think you probably will. I'll sing with you.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: The amazing thing about him… If you think he's 90, it's a five-and-a-half hour session. Okay, there's a break in-between. At 3:00pm, he's still answering questions as sharply as at 8:00am, and if I can do that when I'm 90…
ALEC HOGG: Do you think that if Charlie were no longer to attend, there'd be as many people here?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Most people go for Warren, but once you've been you realise he's the real brain. Warren is smart, but in terms of intelligence level, I think Charlie's above him. He's sharp. I think attendance will start dropping a bit.
ALEC HOGG: Did you know about Charlie Munger before you came here for the first time, 14 years ago?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: No, it was Warren. Then, as you start reading the books, you start realising the influence Charlie had. When Warren started investing, he bought value stocks – the Benjamin Graham approach, and Charlie had a huge impact on his life where he said 'rather pay up, buy quality, something long-lasting, and enduring', so Charlie had that huge impact on him. Berkshire Hathaway without Charlie probably wouldn't have been Berkshire Hathaway.
ALEC HOGG: You brought your son this year, a chartered accountant. That must have been…
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: My son and I are doing this experiment. He wants to go into investments and possibly, I'd like him to work with me, but you don't know. Do these relationships work in business? This is a test.
ALEC HOGG: And he's probably read all the books as you forced all of us to do before we came.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: He read a few, but I made him go… We're visiting about six years back, travelling all over the U.S. and so he's doing the travelling with me. He's already analysing. This is not fun and games, getting on a plane, off a plane, and planes being delayed. Every flight so far has been delayed. The weather played havoc this year.
ALEC HOGG: I'm glad you fixed the hotel up because this special hotel you selected for us…when I first came here, I thought 'well, the Formula One in South Africa would be a little better'.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Exactly.
ALEC HOGG: I don't know what you've done. This morning we had breakfast – bacon and eggs. My room doesn't smell this year.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: When you arrived yesterday, we didn't have bacon yet. Look, I must say I must give Nora a compliment because she's worked on this every year and as you know, to get a hotel booking for so many people is just impossible this time of the year. Moving to next week after the Berkshire Hathaway General Meeting, Nora's on the phone starting to arrange…paying deposits in advance etcetera. Most probably, they've listened to our complaints. It's still a three-star hotel equivalent.
ALEC HOGG: Office star…
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Alec, it's better than an office star.
ALEC HOGG: It is now. I would say it's probably 2.2, and not a Formula One, though. That's for sure. It's not quite at that level, but it's getting there. This year Kokkie, I must compliment you. They have done something. It's a vast improvement and well done.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: We must get them to improve the gym, though. The gym is still not too…
ALEC HOGG: Is that in the parking lot with the hopscotch court?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Exactly, and the chlorine-smelling swimming pool.
ALEC HOGG: It's all part of the fun. What are we doing this weekend, or rather, this week? What's the schedule?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Well, 13 of us are going to the Value Investors' Conference, which is normally quite good.
ALEC HOGG: Do you get a large discount for that?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: We only realised afterwards how many people we'd influenced into going, so we'll certainly talk to them for next year to get a discount, because they do offer discounts.
ALEC HOGG: Does someone like you learn from that?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: It's more guys like Howard Marks, very outspoken guys, long track records, and more to get their views on what they think is happening in the world, so you pick up marginal stuff and it keeps you on course.
ALEC HOGG: But a two-day, that splits up.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Its one-and-a-half days.
ALEC HOGG: A day-and-a-half and then the entire day tomorrow.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: This evening we'll just find a pub somewhere to have fun and drink.
ALEC HOGG: Listen, for what we're paying for that Value Investors' Conference, I think there's a dinner that goes with it.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Last year we decided to skip the dinner. We decided we'd rather sit with our South Africans and talk investments. We can flip a coin.
ALEC HOGG: What's his name…Bill. Wouldn't he be worth going…?
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: The problem I find with those dinners is that 100 people go or 50, you sit at tables, it's noisy, and you still don't get to talk to them. I'd rather sit and chat to you at Four Point with Richard and guys like that and share ideas, but you're right. Friday evening we rented the boat again. We can go on the Missouri and hopefully it's not as cold as it is here with a dinner afterwards, and on Saturday evening, Nora arranged a room for us at Stokes, where the whole group will be having dinner in a room.
ALEC HOGG: With Patrice Motsepe.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: We're trying to get him there. Patrice, are you listening?
ALEC HOGG: You promised last year that you would come, Patrice. You stood us up last year. He had a good excuse, though.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Yes, he stayed afterwards, on the Saturday afternoon after the Berkshire Hathaway meeting finished, to just chat to us so that was nice. It would however be nice for him to come and just share his thoughts with the guys for ten minutes, so we'll pay for the beer and the wine if he comes.
ALEC HOGG: And last year, you had dinner with Warren and…
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Warren and Bill Gates.
ALEC HOGG: I suppose you can forget about that.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: We can forget about that.
ALEC HOGG: Kokkie, we'll keep in touch throughout the next couple of days.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: It will be fun.
ALEC HOGG: Thanks for giving us the background.
KOKKIE KOOYMAN: Thanks.