The NdB Sunday Show: Lauren Evanthia - Heat on Hill-Lewis, “Cat” cuts a deal, Mbalula blames Zuma, Jacinta’s agenda…

Watch here:.Listen here:.In the latest edition of the NdB Sunday Show with Chris Steyn, Lauren Evanthia, the Founder of the Organic Humanity Movement (OHM), talks about fears that the National Shutdown this week could spark unrest with African National Congress (ANC) SG Fikile Mbalula accusing former President Jacob Zuma of fuelling anti-immigrant violence: “..when we reach a point when…systems start to crumble because of government failure and the lack of ethical leadership, what happens is that society starts to take over. And it takes over in a very chaotic way because we don't have a replacement for government failure on such a large scale.” Commenting on the SG’s defence of the ANC Speaker of Parliament over her handling of the Phala Phala matter, she fumes: “..people can hide behind parties...the party politics in South Africa is in my opinion the number one biggest stumbling block towards our progress as a nation”. As for tenderpreneur Cat Matlala cutting a plea deal and turning State Witness, Evanthia charges: “…these commissions of inquiry that keep on happening are just a distraction to the fact that we're not actually going for solutions in this country. Those with power are not implementing solutions.” Also on the agenda is new Democratic Alliance (DA) leader, Geordin Hill-Lewis, under fire already because Cape Town has lost its clean audit status, and the former leader of the party, John Steenhuisen, is spewing bile because he feels betrayed by his erstwhile friend. .Sign up for your early morning brew of the BizNews Insider to keep you up to speed with the content that matters. Register here.Support South Africa’s bastion of independent journalism, offering balanced insights on investments, business, and the political economy, by joining BizNews Premium. Register here.If you prefer WhatsApp for updates, sign up to the BizNews channel here..Edited transcript of interview.Chris Steyn (00:01.061)Welcome to the NdB Sunday Show. With me, Chris Steyn, and Lauren Evanthia, the founder of the Organic Humanity Movement. Morning, Lauren. Lauren (00:12.782)Good morning, Chris. So another interesting week. I know that a lot of people were probably more interested in what was happening in the sports arena, but still the government continues to fail us, so it's important we keep up to date with what's happening. Chris Steyn (00:28.005)South Africa is on high alert ahead of the National Shutdown this week. Foreigners are fleeing and South Africans in the townships are complaining that the people who paid such high rents are also now decamping. Lauren (00:45.174)Yes, the thirtieth of June is looming on us. Just two days from now. So it's happening on Tuesday. I think it's an interesting case study for where we're at in our democracy. So I think I've expressed my views with regards to the strategy that Jacinta is using… Lauren (01:10.232)…to address illegal immigration. But I would like to just zoom out just a little bit because what's more interesting is where we are in our country with regards to our democratic participation. So it seems the people most affected by illegal immigration are the people that are marching naturally. And we had some protest action in Cape Town miraculously, as a small group of a hundred, and we obviously expecting across the country much more. The government, their number one fear, I suppose, is instability in terms of localised violence across the country, roads being blocked, that kind of thing. Obviously, it's also going to affect the economy in various ways. So from a government stability perspective, it's a huge crisis. From a government perspective, it is always a crisis, whether that government is a good government or a bad government when people are mobilising in anger against what the government is doing, whether justified or not. So, from a security standpoint, of course, red flags everywhere. And what I found the most interesting is how many organisations, political and non-political, and how many influential people have spoken against the whole March and March strategy and project, if I may call it that. I actually went and watched Jacinta's most recent public interview. It was over an hour long. And what an interesting woman. She pulled at my heartstrings because she said the reason she started March and March is due to the 25 deaths of children that happened last year, mainly in the Gauteng area, when they consumed poisoned or toxic substances from Spaza shops run by foreigners who are bringing into the country unregulated products. I remember following that story. I remember reading heartbrokenly how a four-year-old child was in hospital and said to their mother, I don't want to die. They knew they were dying. There was no cure. I think it turned out that what happened is that they consumed products that had some kind of illegal pesticide that's supposed to get rid of rats. Terrible. So it's… Lauren (03:31.021)…the root, and as Jacinta so eloquently puts it, the root of the problem is the illegal foreign trade of goods that shouldn't be in this country. And, you know, lives have been lost. And the fact that March and March was started off the back of that. I think I saw Jacinta and the whole movement in a new light. Because we never got answers from the police. Journalists never followed up what happened to those poor children. And isn't that the case with everything that happens in this country? We just don't hear back. We read shocking articles, death, mayhem, and destruction everywhere. We never hear what happens afterwards. So here is a woman that's actually saying no, the government needs to be held accountable on various levels. And so she's from a grassroots level single-handedly raised up a nationwide movement. Are some political and nonprofit organisations perhaps a little envious of her ability to do that because she takes a no-nonsense approach. On the other hand, the danger is as a single person, single figure headed movement, she doesn't necessarily control or have power over how people react. So people with ulterior motives can hijack the 30th of March and commit all kinds of crimes. Who knows? violence and all the rest. So I remember reading Mahatma Gandhi's biography a long, long, long time ago. And one story always stood out to me. And that is, I mean, Mahatma Gandhi criticised figure, sure, but known for passive resistance, known for peaceful protest. And he had organised this nationwide passive resistance protest thing - and it got out of hand in a specific area. And short long story short, someone died as a result. He never advocated for violence, but he couldn't control absolutely every single person that was part of his organised passive resistance protest. And it's the same thing here. So when we reach a point when institutions are not strong and when systems start to crumble because of government failure and the lack of ethical leadership, what happens is that society starts to take over. And it takes over in a very chaotic way because we don't have… Lauren (05:54.423)…a replacement for government failure on such a large scale. So when that happens, there's too many moving parts that cannot be predicted or controlled. And this is why the State is concerned. And I think this is why a lot of influencers and personalities and organisations are concerned because everyone just wants life to continue as close to normal as possible. Let the government deal with illegal immigration. But as Jacinta herself so eloquently pointed out in the interview, is that you know it's easy to talk when you are coming from a middle class suburb. When you are neighbours with illegal foreigners, it changes things completely. So I sympathise with both sides. Yeah, as a woman that has stood up and done something, media's given her car coverage, and it's grown to this point where the 30th of March will probably be the culminating action that will decide where we go forward as a country after this. What else can we as a citizenry do to mobilise? That is my question. Because we've congregated or a portion of the population's congregated around illegal immigration, ignoring the fact that we have a police failure, a government failure, etc. what else can we mobilise around? And what can we mobilize around in a more disciplined structural manner that doesn't necessarily result in the instability of the country. That's what I'm more interested in. Chris Steyn (07:28.354)Hm. Thirtieth of June, by the way. Meanwhile, the African National Congress SG Fikilue Mbablula is accusing former President Jacob Zuma of fueling anti immigrant sentiments. Lauren (07:44.515)I think it's just politicking. All of it's just politicking. Because why do we have the problem of illegal foreigners in the country? The government is failing. Simple. Who's the government? The GNU is the government right now. So it's basically the ANC and the DA and a few others that are forgotten. And he is the MK, he's the opposite. He's not part of the GNU, one of the few parties that aren't part of the GNU, and so it's just natural that he is going to feel anything that's opposing the governments. So I think Mbalula is just politicking, trying to get attention. What he's blaming Zuma for doing, he's doing himself. Because we know how the MK operates. Zuma’s the man in charge, he's the personality, the big personality - and I think we know how he feels about the ANC as well. Hence he started the MK. So I think from a broad perspective, it's just politiking. I think it's natural for the opposition of the GNU to fuel this kind of thing. So I'm curious to see where it goes, like I said, with Zuma's support of Mabahambe. It's an interesting part of history in our country because we haven't seen this level of anti-illegal immigrant sentiment before. It's it's definitely reached a point… because there's been groups before…Operation Dudula and others that have been very vocal against illegal foreigners. And this is probably the biggest fight back. And it's going to be interesting to see what happens and how the government responds. I don't honestly think the government knows what to do except throwing 600 million rand at the problem. And is it enough? And why aren't they putting that money towards actual governing in the first place to prevent situations like this, which brings me to another random point, but it's it's on topic, but it's also a broader point that I feel if the ANC government actually or the GNU even, if every person sitting in government actually just did their job well, they would get the support of the people. And this is the big elephant in the room that no one wants to address. That if the individuals involved in government, if they could just realise, if it could dawn on them that doing their job well would mean continued support… Lauren (10:06.382)…for as long as they do their job well. Then they don't have to fight so much with the public and politics so much. Chris Steyn (10:13.676)In the other big story, the possible impeachment of President Cyril Ramaphosa, the SG has defended the African National Congress Speaker of Parliament, for not wanting to oppose the urgent interdict by the President to try and stop his hearing. According to him, there is no conflict of interest and she does not have to recuse herself. Lauren (10:38.932)Yes, and constitutionally she has the right to remain neutral on this as the Speaker. And obviously politics, politics, politics. We're in this country where we have a multi-party system in our constitutional democracy. And that is the main character, the multi-party facet of our system. And I think it's a huge problem in this country. So how is the Speaker elected in Parliament? people nominate the members of Parliament forward and then there's a vote and obviously she got the majority. She got almost 300 votes out of the 400 seats. I think the EFF also put someone forward in 2024 in June and she obviously won. And she was backed by the GNU stakeholders. So that's an interesting one because she does have the right to be neutral. She said let the courts do their thing, let the process happen, let him do the whole interdict thing and again. To me, it shows that our Constitution is flawed. We have so many problems. We have what we spoke about with March and March, we don't have border control. We don't have a strong police force. We don't have a government that cares about South Africa's sovereignty at all. Not even a little bit. And I'd argue and it goes as far as to say that the government does not care about people in any way. Any infrastructure is for business interests, not for human beings. And system change is the heart of all the solutions. Nothing's going to change unless the system changes. So, with regards to what's happening with the Speaker, it should highlight to people who're following the story that we have a crisis within our political system that parties have all power and all influence. Those who wrote the Constitution, did they think that a party having a majority wouldn't be an issue. Did they think that, you know, something like the GNNU could not happen? Did they think that people would enter Parliament not caring about position and power, but caring for the people? I think this is the problem that we have across the world, that these documents are written with rose-tinted glasses. So I think the Constitution of South Africa was written with the euphoria of the Rainbow Nation and everything that happened around 1994. Written… Lauren (13:02.996)…naively written with rose-tinted glasses, expecting the best of humanity and not considering what happens when people have power and when parties prop up those people in power and people can hide behind parties. There's no accountability because of political parties. So the party politics in South Africa is in my opinion the number one biggest stumbling block towards our progress as a nation. There are so many things that need fixing, but it starts with fixing the political system of South Africa, removing the stumbling blocks. So an ANC speaker is in charge. Is it not a conflict of interest when the president is also a member of the ANC and also a leader of the country again? And he chooses the commissioners of the Chapter Nine institutions. There are way too many red flags in our Constitution that undermine democratic principles and make it impossible to do what a democracy is supposed to do: Help citizens hold the government accountable. Political parties tie our hands and that's a huge problem..Read more:.The NdB Sunday Show: Lauren Evanthia - Zuma fires Duduzile, Cyril ponders DA wish list, Mashatile in China, & councillor & activist gunned down….Chris Steyn (14:14.893)Meanwhile, as more and more worms are crawling out of the police and political capture can, Cat Matlala has cut a deal and turned State Witness. Lauren (14:27.02)Yes, and he'll serve what, seven years instead of fifteen allegedly. So that's an interesting one because he's been mentioned in almost every testimony as this controversial businessman, responsible for so much corruption. But do you think that okay, he's gonna go to…say he goes to jail. Best case scenario, he goes to jail, exposes some rot in SAPS. Do you think that's really going to fix this rotten government that we have. Do you think it's really going to make our country more sovereign? Do you think it's really going to make our government officials more accountable? We need to fix the tender process. There are things we can do to make it way better than it currently is. No, these commissions of inquiry that keep on happening are just a distraction to the fact that we're not actually going for solutions in this country. Those with power are not implementing solutions. They are wasting your time, they are wasting your money as South African citizens. And it's an insult to our collective intellect. And this is why, you know, March on March is happening on one hand around illegal immigration, but on the other hand, why can't more people be as outraged over government failure? It's like we're used to this toxic relationship that we have with power. And it does make me think that there's something more, I suppose, subconscious happening that we too easily perhaps because of our cultures, our religions, our backgrounds, as diverse as we are as a nation, I think we have one common denominator. And that is whatever our culture, religion, or whatever it is, from birth, we are taught to accept authority no matter what. And that is a crisis because look at what it's resulted in. Look where we are now. Just because of the fact that we are taught to accept authority, to respect the government, but they don't respect you. They don't respect me. They don't respect us. And you know, I honestly don't care if he goes to jail or not, there's gonna be more to replace him in terms of just pillaging government coffers. So I see the whole commission really as just a ruse for and an excuse… Lauren (16:41.817)…for government not to actually implement the solutions that really do matter. What are the solutions? Changing the system through reforming the constitution and putting things in place that are truly democratic, not pretending to be democratic. Chris Steyn (16:58.468)The new leader of the Democratic Alliance is already under fire, Hill-Lewis, because Cape Town has lost its clean audit status and then he has the former former leader of the party, John Steenhuisen being very embittered at what he feels is a bit was a betrayal by his erstwhile friend. Lauren (17:19.851)Of course. I mean, on the latter part, that is awkward because both of them have always been high up in the DA together. So it must be really awkward when your leadership role gets in the way of relationships built. But feelings have to be put aside in organisations and an organisation has to do what's best for the outcome of what they want to achieve, whatever their goal is. So I think Steenhuisen needs to reach a point where he admits that he made a big mistake with regards to the Foot-and-Mouth Disease. But besides that, with the clean audit in Cape Town, so for the first time we lost it. According to some news article that has something to do with procurement technicality. He's actually appealing it. And I think, you know, as much as I want to criticize the DA government, I want to actually zone in on what the Auditor General said, something very, very interesting. And that is local governments are doing better while all the metros are doing worse. And I think that speaks to a broader problem that our metro municipalities are too big for one small government to handle. And so to be properly democratic or to adopt properly democratic principles, decentralisation is a very, very important factor. But when areas of government are too large, you're moving away from decentralisation. A local government is obviously a decentralised form of government, but our metros are not working. Our metros are failing. So the auditor general doesn't just look at finances, they also look at the ability to implement service delivery, infrastructure and all the rest as well. It's quite an interesting process. But our metro municipalities are not doing well because they are too populated. And they're not doing anything to stop that. People are just pouring into metros because they are economic hubs. So everyone pulls into metros, me too, me included. I moved from Port Elizabeth to Cape Town many years ago in search of economic opportunity, but Port Elizabeth since has been declared a metro. So people are drawn, it's natural human migration, including with illegal foreigners and citizens. We are drawn to economic hubs in hope of getting… Lauren (19:41.348)…some kind of work and then climbing the ladder to get better work because there are less opportunities in smaller municipalities. And now we have large populations in metros from four million up. And just from a practical standpoint, put feelings and ideology aside from just a logistical, practical implementation standpoint, it doesn't look good. And even if you look at cities across the world, they face very much similar problems from polluted water systems, to homelessness, to drugs, they face exactly the same problems across the world, major cities. And we just carry on because it's normal. It's like this in London. It's like this in New York. So who are we to do anything different? Let's just continue. And I think that is a ridiculous mindset. So we need to look, I think we need to restructure local government. And I think metros should be smaller. They should be divided into smaller, more manageable zones. Because right now we have major problems. Never mind with how citizens or should I say residents in the case of local municipality not being heard by their local government. Local governments themselves, are clearly, according to the evidence, if you look at the auditor general findings, not coping with the workload that they have. Chris Steyn (20:58.315)And lastly it looks like a drone takeover of the city of Cape Town is on the cards. Lauren (21:05.421)My favourite topic, I must say. So a lot of people will think, wonderful, finally, we can deal with crime, drones, drones everywhere. But I actually shudder in terror at the thought of any government, doesn't matter who's in charge, doesn't matter which party. It doesn't really matter if the person, if the government you consider in charge to be good or not. You shouldn't give government that level of power to surveil citizens, because ultimately that's what's gonna happen. It's gonna end up in a complete Nanny State, a Surveillance State, because the whole focus in the article saying that since the first of April, April Fool's Day 2026, the drone programme has been made official. But it's been going on for 10 years. And there's a goal from the city of Cape Town to increase the amount of drone flights that take place from I can't remember the original number, but up to three thousand, I think per year. And this is to, in their words, combat crime. Also they say that drones can be used to deploy I think like lifeboys to help people in distress in water, etc. So I actually just wanna zoom out again a little bit on this because what are we doing? We need to stop as citizens, as people, as human beings on a planet, and just stop for a moment and ask ourselves, what are we doing? Are we really going to outsource all thinking and skills, action and responsibility to government? Do we expect government to fix every facet of our existence? Because yes, we have high crime, especially in Cape Town. It seems to be on the increase. Well, as we know, Port Elizabeth is the winner. But Cape Town has a lot of crime, a lot of deaths, a lot of gang violence, a lot of unnecessary deaths. Children die because of gang violence, but then there's also housebreakings and all the rest and hijackings. And so crime is high. That can't be denied. And I understand people's desperation to want the government to do something. And SAPS, which is a government, a national government mandate, responsibility, Lauren (23:21.589)…is failing completely. So then people look to local governments or private security companies. And drones seem like an easy and practical solution. But what does it result in? Because the City of Cape Town also wants to fine people or police people for their rainwater tanks and solar panels and how many vegetables they grow and all the rest. So where does it end? So we go and they've also encouraged SAPS to also adopt these technologies. Uh-uh, I do not want to give government that amount of power. And I know a lot of people will think, finally the government's doing something, but no people. Wait, wait a minute. What happens when all this infrastructure and all these technologies are applied from national to provincial to local governments on a national scale, in all provinces, in all municipalities? And then what happens? What happens? What are you gonna do when just ordinary things start to become illegal? When it becomes illegal to eat a certain amount of meat a month because it's bad for climate change, you know? What happens when it's illegal to homeschool your children? What happens when it becomes illegal to refuse certain medical interventions? What happens then? What happens when normal, sensible, rational things, things that should be up to you to decide, become illegal, but now the government has all the infrastructure to find you? And it becomes impossible for you to resist tyranny, and it becomes impossible for you to not comply, and it becomes impossible for you as a law-abiding human being, and I say law-abiding with trepidation there, becomes impossible for you to run away…especially if you support this whole nonsense with a government having like all-seeing eye in the sky almost. If you support Government becoming all powerful, all seeing, all knowing, and all powerful. If that's what you want, then you are the problem with the country. Because what we need are people to realise that there are two paths. One path is the path of freedom, which requires complete and utter responsibility for your life. You make sure you're safe. You make sure you do what you need to feed yourself and clothe yourself and all the rest and house yourself. And… Lauren (25:47.468)…you protect yourself and you get skills to make sure you don't get into trouble. For instance, they're justifying using drones because we can save people who are drowning. No. More people should learn how to swim properly. More people should get first aid training. More people who are good law-abiding citizens should carry firearms and learn how to use them. More people should do what it takes to make sure they are fed, housed, safe, protected. And if we have a citizenry like that, we will have a country that's democratic and free. The alternative is what everyone is doing right now. Wanting to give power to government to fix everything. And then what happens? Government becomes all powerful, all knowing, all seeing. And there's no end to what they can or cannot do. And there's no end to how they can destroy your life. So at the core of everything that we've spoken about today, the problem we are speaking about symptoms of a much broader problem. And I've been advocating for years now that system change is the solution, but there's a deeper problem than that, even, and it's our mindset. And we were born into this paradigm, this reality where government and politics are separate to us. It's like this lower thing. We don't want to dirty our hands. We just want comfort and convenience and we just want to get on with our own lives. And we are paying the price for it. So we need to reach a point where we realise no one's coming to save us. We are our own heroes in the story and we can either relinquish all power to the government and suffer the consequences for generations to come or we can carve a different path. And I'm carving a different path for sure. Chris Steyn (27:26.529)Right. I'm with you. That was Lauren Evanthia, the Founder of the Organic Humanity Movement, on the NdB Sunday Show with me, Chris Steyn. Thank you, Lauren. Lauren (27:40.218)Thank you, Chris.

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